Adobe & Apple clash over Flash
Old rivalries continue to colour the battle between Adobe and Apple when it comes to getting Flash onto iPhone
Old rivalries continue to colour the battle between Adobe and Apple when it comes to getting Flash onto iPhone
Back in October last year we reported from the MAX event in Los Angeles, when Adobe’s Kevin Lynch attempted to convince the crowds that Flash was in fact on the iPhone. As it turned out, this related merely to the ability to export apps built with the forthcoming Flash Professional CS5 into native Cocoa/Objective-C code. So in basic principle, designers could build with familiar Flash tools but effectively publish to a platform non-supportive of Flash Player, as we wrote in issue 164:
“Adobe instead attempted something of a quick-change act (during MAX keynote) by suggesting that Flash was already on the iPhone, with a selection of commercial apps listed and available. In fact, what we were shown was a beta version of Flash CS5 professional compiling Flash content as Cocoa applications – the native language for Apple’s coveted device. Agencies such as BlueSkyNorth, Bowler Hat Games and South Park Digital Studios have already started publishing apps using this very method.”
Fast forward to April and the scheduled launch of Creative Suite 5, and Apple decide to drop a pretty hefty bombshell. It transpires, at Apple’s April 8th keynote that the new iPhone OS 4.0 would come with it the SDK caveat prohibiting any such third-party tool from being used in the app development process. In other words, you can’t use anything other than Apple’s own tools provided as part of the official iPhone Developer Program… Cue some anxious Adobe faces suddenly flushing as red as their logo.
The response? Well, Adobe ploughed on with the worldwide online launch last Monday with the ‘Flash CS5 Packager for iPhone’ demo intact and the spokesmen quoted in various sources seemed to suggest that they would “look for loopholes” in order to prevent the feature being rendered useless. It now transpires that Adobe is contemplating legal action, along the lines of anti-competition most can only guess, while its product evangelist’s prefer (unofficially) to tell Jobs and Co. where to stick it.
One thing is certain, we haven’t heard the last of it but there’s a pretty petty undertone to it all. Why would Apple purposefully pick a time so close to Adobe’s CS5 launch to take action, seemingly without notifying them first, and why do both seem to blame the other for the iPhone’s lack of true Flash support?
With the announcement of other initiatives such as the HTML5-powered ‘iAd‘, Apple seems keen to follow an alternative pathway away from Flash completely whilst also denying developers a certain amount of choice when it comes to how they build native content for both iPhone and iPad.
What are your thoughts on it, who is right, and what will it ultimately mean for consumers and designers?
to find out about all the latest web development, news, reviews, previews, interviews, features and a whole more.
Loving this ongoing Geeky soap opera.
If Apple feel they don’t need Flash then so be it, others, me included, will continue to disagree. Loving Apple products as I do and having used them for many years I have accepted the fact that when using their products it is kinda the world according to Apple.
As for Adobe, haven’t they got their fingers in enough pies. Why don’t they just leave the iPhone alone, as for ‘legal action’ it’s just ridiculous after all it is Apple’a product so surely it’s up to Apple what is supported and what isn’t.
Adobe’s time and energy would be better spent supporting and promoting mobile platforms that do support their software like Android.
Bring on the next episode.
It’s like Apple are asking us to draw a picture they can put on their shiny new fridge, but we have to use one type of paper, and only one type of black pen. And even though a lot of people will draw a lot of pretty black and white pictures, at the end of the day they’ll all just be in black and white, limited in the imagination and creativity colour could bring to the pictures.
Cheers John – but is it all down to Apple being narrow minded or are they merely trying to protect the app model? It is their product after all, and does the fairly closed nature of the iPhone development model actually benefit more than it impedes? There are many who feel it helps keep the bar of quality pretty high when you compare it to the Android alternative…
Thanks for your feedback Mark. While I appriciate it that overall, the applications are of better quality on the apple app store than anywhere else – There are several low quality apps on each store. I don’t think that ‘tying down’ the developers to tools that they themselves control isn’t a matter of quality, I believe it’s a matter of control (after all, I’m sure they’ll still be a number of low quality apps released ofr OS 4.0!).
I’m not an apple hater by any means; you’d have to pry my MBP from my cold, dead hands – However, imagine how the internet would look like if we were only allowed to use 2 programming languages – While a lot more developers would become masters in those 2 languages, and the quality of webpages made with those languages would improve, imagine all the potential websites (and developers) we’d lose out on!
Yeah it’s a great point that and certainly Adobe would like to try and widen that potential workflow for designers, lereraging the existing skills and presentation layer of Flash to make app development more accessible.
Of course, I can imagine that native Objective-C developers will be smiling at the prospect of themselves maintaining some control over a pretty valuable marketplace for their services.
I think its a complex situation that can sometimes be trivialised in media terms as two big brands locking horns for the sake of it (in a similar vein to our own post perhaps) but really both parties are trying to protect their product – which isn’t ALWAYS down to an evil, sinister motivation wholly driven by profits.
There is a regret however that instances where technologies can be pushed further and evolved quicker via co-operation is held back in these situations.
Can someone explain the “real” reason Apple does not want flash on their machines. As a web design / graphic person I love Apple but pretty much everyone uses flash so why would you deny your customers this? Yes I think I know why but is there truly a performance issue?
Well some have said, or alledged, that the relationship was soured over Adobe’s apparent lack of Apple support on previous Creative Suite products but this seems a bit silly.
From our experience, both have blamed each other for the lack of support but certainly our conversations with Adobe suggest they want to make it happen but Apple would rather sandbox the app model safely away from Flash. The thinking is that browser-based RIA’s (or games etc) built with Flash technology could negatively impact on the need to purchase standalone apps from iTunes. Effectively, if you make the web richer how do you monetise that content in the same way? With the app market so strong at present it seems logical for Apple not to take the risk.
The performance thing seems to be a red herring from what we’re told. Do you guys have any other theories?
Am I right in thinking that even if a developer were to use Flash CS5 and compile content as a Cocoa application they would still have to submit the app through the app store? If so, then surely Apple are still taking their percentage cut from the sales of the app? This would surely mean that more developers would have access to the environment needed to develop for the iPhone/iPad. I for one would love to have a go at iPhone development but as a Student the sad truth is that I just cannot afford to buy a Mac right now. Having more developers with the ability to create apps then surely Apple stand to benefit from the sales of these apps? I am sure that many high quality apps could be developed using Flash CS5 and users of Apples’ products are being denied the chance to see these. I think its fair enough that Apple don’t want to have full on Flash on the iPhone/iPad because it does bring problems but if CS5 can compile to native cocoa, then what’s the problem?
Surely these two great companies can come to some sort of reasonable agreement then will benefit each other as well as their customers.
You are indeed correct Philip, all apps (unless those for jailbroken iPhones) must be approved and distributed via iTunes. Apple get a cut of the sales so it would benefit them to have more app makers as long as those developers went down the legitimate route to market…
Whilst this could spell the end for Flash, Apple are clearly not winning any friends over this. As a web designer i include flash on 90% of all my sites and it’s a kick in the teeth everytime i go to view one on my iphone. Time to learn jquery i feel!
Philip’s got a great point actually; Business politics aside, I wonder if this move will encourage more users to Jailbreak their phones and acquire the app\feature they have in mind through other means?
I have two main thoughts on this.
The first is that if people want to play in Apple’s playground, then it’s not surprising that Apple will want them to play by their rules – and I don’t see a problem with that. Apple designed the devices and software, so I don’t see that Adobe, or anyone, should be able to dictate how it is used. If Adobe feel so strongly that their stuff – be it Flash itself, or Flash-built apps – be on a phone, then they only need to build their own phone and the problem is solved. It’s the same thign with Palm trying to make iTunes work with their phone, rather than design their own sync software.
My second thought is that Apple are simply trying to protect their users, and indeed themselves, from unneccessarily bad apps. I haven’t tried building an iPhone app via Flash, but I am not convinced that an app built in that way could run as smoothly as an app coded natively. This isn’t a dig at Flash, rather an observation that virtually all ported stuff I’ve used or come across is inferior to stuff done from scratch in the correct environment.
Not all iPhone users are geeks – a lot of users won’t know that their favourite app isn’t made by Apple, they’ll just know they’ve got an iPhone and if something goes wrong, it’ll be the phone’s fault. Just this morning I saw a tweet from someone complaining that their Twitter client wasn’t working on their iPhone, and that it must be a problem with the phone…
By restricting apps to only those coded using Apple’s tools, Apple can rule out problems caused by an issue with someone else’s compiler. That doesn’t mean that there won’t be any “bad” apps, but it will rule out one big potential cause.
Also, by going down this route, Apple have full control over the development tools, so if they need to roll out updates – perhaps fixing a problem, perhaps switching to a different CPU in the devices, then they can.
While I agree with the notion that its Apples product, and they can do what they like with it, ultimately , the consumer (and devs) suffer due to this decision. Its not just the CS5 framework thats been curtailed, its all other non direct C or Javascript frameworks such as Unity3D that wont be allowed. This could slow down development time, for iPhone apps, as well as for cross platform apps. I suspect that this is one of Apples goals, to make it harder to quickly build cross platform apps and games and try and force devs to focus on just the AppStore with its huge market share.
Will it lead to more jailbreaking? Maybe a little, but Average Joe in the street wont hear a word , or care about Apples decision. This move on its own isn’t going to affect development too much I think, but it does add another hoop for devs to jump through, and perhaps give pause for thought on whether to put so much time and effort into iPhone.
John, I think you are right it is highly likely that more users will be tempted to jailbreak their iPhone’s to acquire these new apps/features. As soon as word gets around that these apps are available and websites spring up showing them off people are going to want them. I think Apple really would be shooting themselves in the foot by not allowing them through the app store, but hey who am I to challenge the mighty business minds at Apple!
I am trying to find something that comes as a surprise in this. Apple is hardly a company interested in the sociology of computing and champion of the end users best interest – it always seems their bias is toward self interest. Why does everything that works with Apple NEED to be Apple? We have moved from the stone ages. The Apple Following always ignores this view as if living in a timewarp ever since Apple licensed its OS way back when….this is less about the performance or the reliability / stability / security of the applications and more a strategic play emboldened by recent successes.
This is about Apple and that it does not play nicely with others. To them its either HTML5 or Flash. Things can co-exist. Apple doesnt want this without control. They’re a company saved by the I-pod, and now they want to be calling the shots on application software? Maybe you’ll show them they cant bottle the genie.
Apple has a feudal mindset. Why do they forget that once I pay the extremely high price they ask for an everyday product such as a phone (no matter how shiny it is), it stops belonging to them. Whether I use it to play a game, for merely calling someone or for frying an egg on top of it, its my f@$#ing decision. Apple cannot dictate its terms to me. If I want to browse a flash based website, then I have the right to do so. Its ‘MY’ right to install whatever apps, made with whichever technology. Apple products are like a prison made of gold. At the end of the day its remains a prison. Mr.Jobs don’t sell me a plate and then insist that I buy my all food from you. To hell with your anti-social elitist product.
http://bit.ly/bglOnC
Looks like Apple managed to crush Adobe’s ideas before they even really got started. “Adobe will still provide the ability to target the iPhone and iPad in Flash CS5, but the company is not currently planning any additional investments in that feature.”
Shame.
At a time when Microsoft are being forced within the EU to provide a patch publicising alternatives to Internet Explorer (including Apple’s Safari browser) on every machine with Windows installed on it, it seems incredulous that Apple is largely getting away with strategies to actively prevent third party software from running on their operating systems.
Having helped a client to set up a new iPhone recently, I wouldn’t personally want one. It is a very nice piece of kit, but despite having paid hundreds of pounds for it you can’t complete the set up of it without giving your credit card details to Apple whether or not you intend to buy any apps from them. Surely that is wrong?
As a web developer, I have Safari installed on my PCs … and get fed up with it trying to install iTunes on a regular basis as part of its update process.
I’m not particularly pro-Microsoft or anti-Apple (I’m from a UNIX background and would probably run happily with Linux if I didn’t need to keep up with what my customers are running) but it does seem that there is one rule for Microsoft and another for Apple. What say we launch a campaign forcing Apple to provide an update for for OSX to launch a window offering Internet Explorer as an alternative browser? :-)
Apple and the app system on iphones was made by the support which apple got from the developer community. With these steps, apple risks isolating many people in that community, who may then decide that it is time for them to take their skills elsewhere, such as to developing better android apps.
So, in a sense, I think that apple is undervaluing the developer community in regards to it’s own success in this, which a community who predominantly favour adobe development and design software, and so apple may find that by not supporting adobe, it could be shooting itself in the foot.
I also think that apple is getting dangerously like microsoft in trying to establish complete control over things, in a monopolistic manner, which is not in the true spirit of an innovative computer/creative industry.
I’m disappointed that they can’t resolve their differences. Not only are users losing out but I’m sure Apple are losing potential iPhone sales due to the lack of Flash.
Pray tell, what is the fuss? Apple doesn’t make a habit of developing perfect products, just good ones that fall a little short of being the best out. Take the I-pod for instance, you still can’t record on those things and that was a luxury that even your old tape deck had. Until quite recently you couldn’t port the music you bought on I-tunes to any other device without digital rights management complaining about it or not letting you full stop. The I-phone itself until its latest incarnation sported a really poor camera, 3.5 megapixel. The current only a mere 5 megapixel. There are phones on the market with 10 megapixel cameras. My point is this, Apple don’t even make the best computers on the market, have you ever seen the spec of an Alienware PC and compared it to the spec for an Apple laptop. There is a world of difference between Apple products and perfect products. Why do their subpar developments even cause much of a stir anyways? They consistently fail to recognise the wants and needs of the consumer, and no offence, people all throughout the computing community still harp on about how great they are when they clearly need to shape up their act if they want to contend. Flash verses Apple is just the latest silly 9mm round Apple is putting in its own foot. Compatibility across products will end up with a standard of its own before long and everyone will be using cross compatible software. If anybody you should moan at Apple for costing you a fortune to be able to develop for them in the interim with yet another set of tools to buy. If Apple is so great why are they costing you money?